hello everyone and welcome to another episode of Jasmine to call Adventures Travelers on Perris and simply mind bogglers my name is thorsten Jacoby and I'm your host play I'm talking to Chris Thomas Ave Chris is a travel industry matter on the 20 20 years of experience and has a ton of War stories to share excited to have him yet today we going to talk about Chris's list of favorite countries we are also talking about the travel industry during call with & Beyond wheel find out why Airlines Summerlin Library want the flight and some Airlines acotar is probably never will make any moneywe'll find out what happened to Thailand's tourism economy and would roll Freedom Place in Economic Development Across the world this episode of the podcast is sponsored Bommarito's premium this is also my business in case you wondering but thousands of our subscribers is really just one thing is saving money on airfare the same thing works for hotel male students for five star 4 star hotels and of course economy business class first class premium economy tickets the best thing is many countries are opened up again and Americans and Europeans can go to almost 80 countries again as of November 15th 2020 to give it a shot tried out for free this is my travels. Com MTP for everyone is a little challenge with all these letters just go to MTP for you.com 5 characters MTP for you.com and start a 30 day free trial pretty excited today to have Chris Thompson on the judgement call podcast on Chris spend almost two decades of the major traveler and travel tech companies like Emirates and Choice Hotels and Chris is now an angel investor and it's more Hands-On as an entrepreneur hey Chris how are you I'm good thanks for having a great to have you here and deed before the show you mentioned that you grew up and almost without the country so how did that feel there on this first assignments in Thailand and so I was actually born in Thailand and grew up Haulover Thailand Laos India Sri Lanka Iran and the US Oregon maryland-virginia Illinois New York in Georgia and I'm currently living in the Washington DC area after having moved here from Dubai so I hope to answer the question directly it if it's awesome now kind of having being able to look back on that experience but actually at the time it was kind of tough so I mean during the 1970s 1980s. That's before you know the internet before mass communication technology so moving every few years to a new country at to a new school it is very hard as a kid to keep in touch with people they're not going to like write letters and things but really taught me something valuable to be really flexible and adaptable to new situations so it wasn't until I was about 20 years old that was able to look back on that and say oh wait a minute that was really awesome so you know now with the benefit of hindsight I guess it's a really valuable experience it's certainly very well in my career but at the time it was top I won't like the front of his home so what's the country or the nation he's so he wants to associate with he had like six or seven passports and then while this is great in this once you become an adult as a kid for you you really doubt yourself what what's the what's the country you you feel most at peace with but that said I'm comfortable in a lot of places still having having lived in a lot of places and also having visited a lot of places I'm tired of of the opinion that no place is perfect every place has pros and cons you speak sometime that's one of the language completely escaped so I I learn languages quickly but if I don't use them I forget them so at various points in my life I have spoken sometimes I from Lao Japanese Farsi and Arabic and french fries Taco Bell challenge to keep it like that I have to keep them forever but that's not me I learned them if I don't use them they're gone for at least the put into the B archive memory of my brain was pretty flew into Russian for quite some time and then I didn't use it for 10 years and not to win a couple days ago and I felt like all the words are coming back will capillary cuz I remember so it's still there but the if you would have asked me before I went I was like I don't know nothing you you have a very interesting story also how you got into a travel and travel pack I'll tell me about that a lot of teenagers at least in the u.s. you're not really given this freedom to pursue whatever you want to pursue it's not implanted into you like it is in Asia from an early age of to know if you will be a doctor or something like that so I was going to be a lawyer because that was the cool thing to do in the 1990s but after I graduated from college I went to Thailand on a vacation and I accidentally got a job in the travel industry and the way that happens is I was complaining about bad service from a travel agency and since I was 22 years old I didn't have an agenda I didn't have a desired outcome I was just complaining and the general manager who I was complaining to ask me how long I was going to be there and I said two months and he said okay you're hired to do what Krista was the Infamous 1 Bangkok and so you know he said you're higher than I was like to do what I said to fix it and I guess I did because my two months vacation in Bangkok convinced of four and a half years of living and working there and it was great and it lost my travel industry career law school went out the window and instead I came back to get an MBA in the US and then spent the next 20 years and travel and that's what I'm still going how did your parents react when you told them you're not going to be a lawyer that they must have not been very excited I think my mom probably would have preferred that I became a lawyer she's Asian my dad just wanted me to be happy. Are you not to be honest and you even a few years into that working in the travel agency in Bangkok I still didn't think of it as a career I mean it wasn't until I was like wait a minute you want to do this as a career for the first two years I was actually still thinking that I was going to be a lawyer and it's like Travel Stop was just that it's just like a stop on the street has attracted a lot of people that do have an entrepreneurial Gene in their system and has gone to man you see a lot of stuff study law once upon a time and trouble always had this this opportunity opportunity that if you come up with a specific tools are specific or I could be there was a lot of potential growth knitting saying that way before covid-19 the obvious issue of Miss that people expect a lot of things for free you know you go to travel agent and he helps you find flights only helps with all your queries you go to a financial advisor and 99% of an hour you would never consider this for a travel agent and so does online to you know I run the left side there be charged for a subscription and it's been going well but it's being exceptionally happy that it goes as well as it does the most travel tools people generally expect everything and maybe because people have gotten rid of all of that the margins that used to be that is is an industry that seemingly I think I mean I have an opinion on that so you cannot just an opinion but yes you're absolutely right well before David the travel industry is notoriously famous for low margins but you know if you look at the businesses that works typically associated with travel so Airlines which is a very capital-intensive business so it takes a lot to know a tough to earn a good margin there or travel agencies with at least in the US traditional attracted people who were less educated and maybe more part-time workers stay-at-home Housewives people like that so it's good for a lot of people it was a hobby so is it just the type of person that was a factor to the travel industry it was kind of the Cutthroat Wall Street Investment Bank or type so I think there wasn't the focus on margins and where you've seen higher margins in the travel industry it's been with generally the technology side of things or in the hotel industry actually from the real estate appreciation side of things so those things that are creating the value of the levers sing a technology or the appreciation of real estate that is a traditional tourism Hospitality technology a couple travel Adventures of travel teams always be the hardest to raise money and also to launch and then make it off the ball today is definitely more user interest so that's a little easier but in general it's it's it's hard to get these two curves together between what you spend to Lucky with the make online and I mean in the US just before Alaska was the highest the highest behind profitability it's really not that impressive in terms of margins I mean you talked about getting up you know 10-12 13% margin so that's why I thought it was pretty impressive let me know if they're in a special spot and the economy was roaring so hard is Elena drive a couple famous quotes right I mean that was Sir Richard Branson I believe he famously once said that the best way to become a millionaire was to start as a billionaire and then start an airline and then also Warren Buffett I think it said you know if the Wright brothers plane had crashed that would have been the best thing as far as Connor Financial returns for the traveler by whatever is driving very few people who have made a ton of money and travel and obviously they're there are many of when I say very few what I mean is as a percentage I called it a couple of times that he has to be profitable because they call it the downstream market and then he'll probably be talking to a couple of local carriers regional carriers and they say you know he make money or not is is really not relevant cuz whenever someone goes to the country is a toonie I'm out that spends on average 3 for $500 a day that's what helps that's for entertainment that is for meals and that money is being recaptured by the government involved with taxes and they know that he's numbers a ride because you know every hotel registers the guests and so the only fifty bucks a hundred bucks whatever it is is is ruining as no relation to the total Downstream Revenue that the government in the context of a state-subsidized airline for certain countries but in the u.s. do you know where the airlines are stand-alone entities in the expected to be palpable in their own right that's a different story why we have so many airlines that have gone out of business over the decades in the US directions maybe a little higher but it doesn't stream capture for a government might be depending on the destination and how it is to the Maldives is easily a thousand bucks profit what I would say is Qatar is a very good example of what you were describing so whether about end has never made money never and would be covid-19 the employees for the most part live in Qatar which means they're renting or buying real estate from government-backed real estate companies they're spending their salary on goods and services in Qatar Airline is buying fuel from the state owns Atari petroleum company you know all of these things put together right it's just the economic impact is a huge that's even before you count the tourist and the businesses and the business traffic that arrived on Qatar Airways as a result of them operating Airlines so in the net it is absolutely a positive so it doesn't matter you know if they lose you know a couple billion dollars a year and it is a negative facts on the oil they always say Allen oil and so it is it is a good way to invest that have some control over it is better to buy just another mutual fund or just another part of the state they have a competitive worldwide organization and a half ton of control over it I think it's a very small ants try to be even if it looks a little weird that maybe is moving out of this but I do have the same bracket to make a profit and empty hide in the past anyway has kind of been run with the goal of a prophet in mind but Qatar Airways very clearly not run with the goal of an airline profit in line how did you feel while you were at Emirates given that they have very different set of objectives at the time already a lot of European and US companies I'm objecting to Emirates fly into st. Roberts the day do because Emirates has or had very little incentive to make money at the time like 10 years ago where we saw it when I was there there was a lot of pressure from the German government to Frankfurt and Munich and they wanted more frequencies they wanted their lending and cologne and some other places in the German government was like no one maybe two flights a day from Germany to the UAE that was the way the the bilateral agreement was structured there was a similar kind of Scott with the Canadians and the Canadians didn't want to give Emirates more rice but for the most part you know people were okay with it I'm going to say people I mean countries governments are like okay well and a lot of effort to public relations in government lobbying efforts that they look okay yes you know poor Lufthansa they're not making as much money because I'm worth fly so much to Germany but if you look at the net effect to the German Auto that's a positive I mean you can't kick out Emirates and and protect Lufthansa I mean that's great clips onza but it's not good for terminally ill offenders good for Germany I would very much doubt that I mean have you left there and seeing if he at first and it looked under enjoyed inside Europe it's gotten better now but that cannot be good for economic growth and infrastructure development but it's not good for stance on fan of you no convincing the powers-that-be whether that's the public or the politicians who were in charge of influencing policy in front of the benefits of that you're not going to get everybody 100% of course what was more interesting to me was after I and maybe kind of amusing after I moved back to the States and I was out of the airline business I was in the hotel business but I still followed the airline business by closely and the US carriers in particular Delta United in American took this big PR campaign to convince the American government's in the American Consumer of the evils of foreign subsidiary of Emirates guitar and but you know it's just so hypocritical and essentially these these airlines in the US are essentially saying well top cities are bad if it's for my competitor but if some of these are for me then it's okay and then now once covid-19 authority over a given just a little bit of market economic logic we should all be seeing flights from everywhere to everywhere like African hunting supplies building out they have fifth Freedom Rides you can you can do whatever you want the most of Africa Ethiopian can offer hop and hop and dick is Frank Newark until they initially but that they give up on this pretty quickly. For this is the money right so Airlines have a lot of money at stake so they give some of that money to politicians who will support protectionism and that's what happens tell me you see this in the hotel industry to with like in New York the hotel industry lobbying to prevent Airbnb and similar things that are substitutes to ourselves right so it's the end of the day it's companies big powerful companies protecting their financial interest against the interests of the bigger country but that's not the point it's like the Lufthansa Germany well I mean big they basically forced to give up on the Monopoly and an easy child there's always another competitive moved in and I think recreated at the Euro and I want the streets going to look like in Germany at least the principle of a free market 30s 40s in the to even if some of these new lines of pretty crappy to Fly Frontier a couple years ago and I thought it was awesome was way better than United I'll just bring it back but it was brand new aircraft and back and forth and everyone hates everyone I thought it's awesome and they seem to do way better now at Legion swell recovering from generally recovered more quickly because I mean want one of the friends that I see some of the time is coming forward with David is Leisure Travel recover more quickly than business travel domestic travel before International and younger people before older people so that bodes well for the spirits Allegiance Frontier Southwest not so well for the United Delta's American Coed some people say you know everything is going to be that friend and we all going to go around it PPE equipment and others feel good being with include myself now and I'll give it two or three years if it's going to be pretty much to say and maybe slightly better more efficient than what it is to be somewhat down in the middle of some things will go back to what we see is normal but some things will change right so if you look at what happened after September 11th 2001 there became this focused on security and this is now 19 years later and that focus in large part is still with us right I mean either willingly subject themselves around the world too much more stringent security regulations than we had in the year 2000 so I do think going forward that there will be some things as a result of covid-19 temperature check. There will be some things that stick with us in travel and that that will be with us for a long time but I think that's like you said will there be a bounce back to normal at I see that as well right I mean I don't think that what we experience right now today and November of 2020 so many people sitting at home afraid to travel. That's not going to last forever one of my least favorite words with the word never so you could eat like a business travel will never return or conferences and events will never be what they once were so you don't never is a long time. I don't like the word never I do think that it will be a while and if we're being honest about the airline industry it's instructive to look at what's happened and see how long that takes to recover so if you look at the reception of like 2000-2001 for the most part it wasn't until 2007 that the depending on what you're measuring for their that's revenue or Revenue passenger kilometers passenger something like that but a lot of those financial Netflix did not return to the 2000 levels on Soul 2007 six years after the reception similarly after the 2008-9 reception those levels didn't return until 2015 so again you're looking at 6 7 years later and so now if you extrapolate that and look at Fogo so that happened in 2020 what we're really talking about is at least 20 26 before full recovery and because covid-19 exactly 2026 but I think really if you look at like American Airlines and United and if you look at some of the metrics that they hit the high water mark in 2019 so you know it is important to be specific when people say recovery so when will let's just take United Airlines when will United Airlines recover well you know 2020 is a washer but in 2021 will they be able to add flights back and make money I think there's a very good possibility of that right and certainly by 2022 they should definitely be able to make a money box with what we're talking about is hitting those 2019 numbers again that very realistically is probably 2026 to 20:30 somewhere in there so that's a pretty thought projection that probably likes find profitability might come back earlier or later that's the biggest you obviously is international flights the the Panic that I guess it was initially created by people themselves and then I moved into the government's CarGurus now Des is confusing array in Europe on degree of on what would make sense if you'll make no sense at all and I will talk to him with a friend yesterday who's in Dubai at the moment he said the The covid Experience fire line is ridiculous because life on fly do I say turn off the in-flight entertainment because of Provo and I were talking about like on Turkish so I'm Turkish they used to be very famous for a pretty fancy meal service but now that's been scaled back to pull Hills and boxes because of coated with Neil and missile I'm like okay baby I mean maybe they going to apologize to me later and I mean Rhonda guess the trouble is that nobody really knows what to do about it everyone is trying to rush your signal and put cleaning on them at page and is telling everyone that this is going to be safe at the opposite of safety is more or less in business and first class offering the same level of Premium Food Service Lufthansa business-class which was completely empty then it was delicious and we get full attention from the flight attendants are they wanted the characters haven't seen a lot of passengers and six month is sad but it's the exact opposite of the service in Turkish cutting it back you see Turkish not getting amenity kit but then Singapore Airlines which didn't have amenity kits in business until recently their practice has been and if you need a toothbrush for slipper socks eyeshade something like that they pass them out to those who need them or you can get them in the laboratory but now because of Cove in Singapore Airlines is introducing a business class amenity kit on so well it's it's it's not I sometimes feel like the psychological damage we've done by telling everyone how dangerous dangerous it's not there that the infection that happened. The evidence of the office at the studies of came out it was one two weeks ago was extremely small number of confirmed infections during the flight out of all the messages delete past Joseph Lewis and smart one of the most eye-popping statistics that I saw from I think the United Airlines CEO think of it was that the 12 it infection rate among their flight attendants is lower than the covid infection rate of their ground him quotes actually being in the air is safer than being on the phone but if you stop and think about it it makes sense because on all these Airlines like United they are mandating that they have the HEPA filters going and they're paranoid about cleaning versus people on the ground just living their everyday life are not necessarily doing those things yeah I mean that was always the worst case scenario that people posted on Twitter and go back in April and February studies before that they did about SARS not infectious diseases if one person sneezes about Mass going to be having a mask is better it would affect up to 45 people before they even reached the filter so if you say if you could get covered and I think it would be a Triumph you're finding out now that I need to start a viral load if you just have lunch Devon cell via just finding out more about how does infection actually works and if the viral load is not high enough say it's really just a few cells to come out of someone smoke anyone get attracted to me if I could get a few million really happening at close contact and fortunately not in a plant in March or April a person who speaks Arabic is terrorist and you like we literally just wait for that moment after 9/11 but even maybe not right now but in the past few years there still people is like oh my gosh you know there's a an arabic-speaking person on my plane we're going to die at the end over just coming in to land on the you know you have to be seated and you'll see the buckle up and he jumped off run through the aisle and start praying and start praying not a good sign but nothing happened except on a minute later the yeah I mean you know but people are going to panic because in Parts the media and the public perception kind of encourages. So you know this kind of see something say something and now you're going to have that we're supposed to have people know they see somebody nearby without a mask and they freak out if the person doesn't have a mask on doesn't mean they have phobias and it doesn't even if they did their going to infect you so try to keep it in perspective a little bit I mean yes people should we have less real collections of if you don't really know who to trust anymore so it's it's more cumbersome for people to figure out the truth because they have to do all the research themselves and sources that are more trustful and I think we all have lost trust and now it's situations problem to with the Internet is people now have their own sources of so your truth can be different than mine might be different than my sources and we could literally have the complete opposite conclusion which is what you have in the US with people who you know on one hand they're like have to wear a mask and then there's people on the other side just say no you should never wear masks yeah it is I mean these statistics on help you know every country concerts at The Cove at that stuff on play someone who only tested positive for the last 4 weeks can be accounted discovered that and number for fractions and many countries is only being hounded if you actually have symptoms that you need a care in the hospital then the other night man I think people have been struggling especially March and April and since then there's been so many numbers that fortunately turn out to be much better than we all thought but this a pig has been slow and I saw a Hawaiian Airlines for United Airlines jump yesterday champion of the year before we connect the vaccine can get approved tomorrow and it's going to be a while to produce enough Doses and get them distributed to the point where there is a substantial portion of the population that has immunity that even if that happens tomorrow and don't forget to deny science and refuse to where I'm at I can pretty much guarantee those are going to be the exact same people who refuse to get it back I mean just this amazing success stories in Asia or countries that haven't done anything like Japan and Taiwan I did Sweden obviously that has been a success story and they're only three destinations in Murray KY traffic that has the same address directions but the travel inside the European Union has been going on for the last month and had everyone in the European Union was a pound in Munich because they have otherwise empty so it is a convenience Convenience Site in the US have really messed up that the psychological yeah and you know for the travel industry to recover we need people to be mean it doesn't have to be 100% but you need people to be directionally in agreement about this. Of situations make me say it if you have 50% of the people who say well he's gotta wear masks and socially distance and the other 50% of the people say you should never wear a mask and you should mix and mingle together that is just not going to work as far as I'm talking very practically as far as getting the travel industry to recover when you go to Greece I will spend the last month outside Airport restaurants are open in liquid where were you on that. There was no social life with restrictions like everyone Brown mask and you would get the same protection everywhere just a better mask yourself so I didn't have an undertaking Pacific issue wrongfully video I mean wearing a mask is it physically idea and that a lot of these places like sweet in Taiwan Japan they wear masks and they always did like a butterfly think anybody but I think any percent helps right I mean yeah maybe baby when you have a significant what I feel is is a big driver for myself a trouble and that's always the different depending on each individual is this the sense of adventure to Sansa for yassa to set up I want to see what else is in this world wants to go to Mars in a first I I would recommend them to go to peanut any country in Africa that would be equally interesting it's totally not looking like Mars that's not what I wanted to say and there is there's a lot of Adventure just by being there I'm just getting out of your comfort zone for this. Everyone needs to wear a mask I mean I'm most of these countries are definitely have a high crime rate to happen to have a high crime rate against but it's a great experience and it's worthwhile even accepting a higher rate of crime desk diseases and for this not everyone needs to comply that's what I want you safe place to explore and they're still 1% fat percentage of whatever the numbers are making much lower who are following you around we're taking care of straight from the airport in a higher police officer play some places with high crime but yeah what was your favorite a lot of people yet you you you were saying so I in North America I'll choose the United States in South America I will choose she light in South Africa in the Africa I like South Africa admittedly I haven't explored as much of it as I have other continent Antarctica have not been New Zealand part of Australia New Zealand Thunder Lagoon Domino Harvey's if I have to choose just one I might go with Italy I like it a lot and in Asia is also very hard since it's so big but I might choose the place of my birth Thailand 2527 but I feel like you have to go to a couple different places just to get a feel for it and it states and forget the whole United States just take the state of California if you went to San Francisco and then the Mojave Desert and then up to Lake Tahoe and then down to the beaches you know off Monterey that's four different places all in the same state with a completely different feel so few people in the United States have a passport laws for travel to Canada in the Caribbean but the the the reason is that I've often said his fault cuz the United States there is a lot I mean the diversity is its largest of nature but especially dangerous is pretty striking here only a few other countries are there how do you get to different oceans Kyle animal if you call the Baltic Sea and Ocean and the North Sea I like going from northern Pennsylvania to Southern Pennsylvania the last 20 years and I want that goes off twice a year rustic at the wrong people and it was cheap and it was a shadow of its former self and look at all the little Islands they all look like cows on road and struck the mass tourism development wherever you go what I felt in Thailand was exceptionally fast went downhill and feeling a lot of places in Thailand be on the same subject to reason what time is it and now but I always felt this way too many people there if not I was like why doesn't like maybe in five years or whatever but we going to be like people in Thailand that depend on the tourist for their income so you know I think it's something like fifteen twenty-five 15% of GDP or thereabouts oh that's pretty significant the Maldives or something like that but that's pretty significant so they need the Taurus back and so you're going to see the tourist come back but it's funny that you mentioned Laos because I remember in the 90s when my parents were living there and you know they're there was a lot of high pressure on the loud government open up back in those days they did not really allowed tourism and they were that the ties were pressuring allowed to open up and said he left you can have all this truism and you can be just like us and I remember some of the lauv officials are like is that what we want I mean Philippines are a similar example of a bad way because Taurus and girls who have the faster it's going to change right so it also depends on the Baseline so I think Klaus has changed a lot in 20 years but because they started with you know like for Forest so if you know you get up to 4000 in Thailand I mean I can remember in maybe the 80s potty outside of Bangkok I was like oh that's kind of a interesting Beach place but my parents said that like in the 60s style and puffy I was very glamorous by the dump and then they got it cleaned up and then poop it was one hotel hotel Phuket was the only hotel in Phuket and you know and then over the years of course it's become overdone but that would some of these other Islands the ones that might be you know any given year so thin in the year 2000 some underscored Island that you might have gone to 20 years later is now overrun with tourists I mean I mean but if you saw what I saw in Dubai I've never seen anything like that anywhere because that was some fast change I remember in like 2008 a friend came to visit in Dubai and he was like the last time I was here was in the year 2018 that I don't recognize that method that's probably a little bit like saying you've been to Los Angeles before in 1942 by is do it's kind of you know you used to say decide he wants to develop city outside of Vegas and send it all together and they felt and there's like five star wars for Building & Free olive olive tree Italian chain so it's extremely artificial bye-bye just a ton of money that's how I Do by Fairfield to me nearby correct me on this but I think it's the money that I earn somewhere else has nothing to do with how this individual eventual make money at Meijers is entrepreneurial idea what size is not crappy one certainly and across and you build a figure is a light that you know more people come and then you don't even take a resort and I think this is awesome the trouble is to just go to the next Love Like War what Thailand needs more device. Development have y'all going to put in x amount of money and get high at 2 to manage this property for us to visit to the next scale of you can have mass tourism Singapore people the you know the difference between Singapore and Thailand is kind of the dictatorial governments that just tells you this is how it's going to be our economy but I'm saying that there are benefits of having centralized control versus just birth control if you delete a I mean definitely some positives in Dubai to being under dictatorial rule terms of the the planned infrastructure that happened right so like in the US and I'm certainly not advocating for dictatorship I'm just saying you can have one guy that says this is what we're going to do I mean just like with a company right about the script or economy so the idea is that your pool ideas and crypto together and then but it's it's taking up it's free or at you can pull money from individuals as well as pom pom pom company is so it's it doesn't at least that all the restrictions that often create the trouble in the marketplace so we we we associated with the failure of the market economy but what would have happened I should have been a better outcome for everyone of all because it would make more money right so it fits into the market economy I don't have a good good idea. All the places I've been to what we strike me about Africa crap you have a dictator up there but still the infrastructure of this a problem like or semi dictator in many places I mean but there's a lot of individual freedom for people even if you have a tutorial agar Amanda doesn't care about you and basically on your own the good news is there's a lot of personal freedom that you can use to shape your life the way you want that might be an efficient and Rose would be actually make everyone much better off but it gives you this boost of a freedom and at some point in your life so is the development always better than Fredo I I would say the answer is no help out the poorest parts of this Society but in the end it is a People's Choice or failure of choice like like I said at the at the beginning of the call I've been to a lot of places and so I I do have a perspective that for the most part things aren't necessarily bad or good in one place they're just different given given the choice between having running water and no running water well I choose running water it's this very philosophical I think you did this check the social sciences in the last time I think we should make that claim that every every outcome is acceptable because it exists depending there is no there is no metric to really say this is a better or worse to make their own personal choice right so like I said water are no running water but what about this one what about Freedom or electricity have freedom but I had electricity open up the border with Germany because we wouldn't have couldn't have electricity and Vivi we wouldn't have basic needs met which was probably true for some parts of the population and anybody who says it's perfect they haven't experienced enough right I was talking a month or two ago with someone who lived in Tucson Arizona and she mentioned to me that she's you know Days Inn Tucson and she's never lived anywhere but Tucson but she's very confident that Tucson is the best place on Earth has ever been. I don't know what to say but my point is okay if that's all you've ever seen how how how do you know right now so expiration keeps repeating mistakes in our life those who do not travel read only a page I don't know that we're going to change the world but certainly there will be an impact so I'll talk about them I just wanted to sign so hacker Panda and this is building a network of Youth hostels it's about a five-year-old company we've been hit pretty hard by the pandemic so back on March 1st we had eight properties open and we're looking to expand across Europe southeast Asia and the United States but now because of covid-19 backpacking hostile space that will be one of the early segments to recover your problem so I feel good about that business but the original Vision was kind of to be like a lot of good ideas it came out of someone's personal experience though in this case tomorrow the CEO and founder he is Indian but he studied in Germany and in Canada and during the time that he was studying in Europe and North America a backpack to round and discovered that hospitals were really different from one location to another and he said there's got to be a better way to do this has got to be you know a way to know in terms of standard so that was really the vision so the way I used to describe it is that we wanted to be the Marriott of Youth hostels not Marriott in a luxurious way but Marriott in terms of common standards of safety amenity a loyalty program you know if he went to a country tomorrow that you've never been to and you saw a Marriott without even setting foot inside it you have a pretty good idea of what to expect and so that's what we were trying to do with the youth hostel guess there are some other chain so actually I would say one of our biggest competitors is was I mean right now they're surviving better than we are all generator and the they acquired a u.s. chain last fall just about a year ago so they have I'm guessing I don't know I doesn't 220 properties may be so that's like us the other even bigger than ours or like 12:20 rooms for the generator ones are like they'll have like three hundred bands 100 Bands and that's kind of where we were heading so what do you think of the of the hotels in Japan has stayed in the more you know western-style hotels in Japan 5 so much appreciate but I'm not okay with just a light on in the morning but I was amazed and it's kind of like if you sleep right next to each other at the same place and it looks like a cow once you get into your YouTube into your your your cable coughing is almost completely soundproof best sleep I've ever had 12 hours and I was blown away by it I was like what I mean it's it takes a lot of pressure to get someone into triangles once they do yeah no I haven't done it but I have a lot of space in the middle of Japanese hostel type of thing Omar Danza is that it's not just about the conserving of real estate spaced and the chief accommodation it's really kind of an experience and a lifestyle and the of course most of our Travelers are young but you don't have to be young but as somebody described it to me one of the somebody said you know you said if you go somewhere and stays in a hotel and this is a single guy he said if he sees a pretty woman at the bar and walks up to her to strike up a conversation she might or might not be open to having a conversation in a hotel and he said however 99% she's going to be interested in having a conversation with him but doesn't mean that she's romantically interested but she will at least be friendly and open to having a conversation because it's a different mindset right the type of person who stays at a hospital there are looking to meet people make single socialize you do have a lot of space she don't have it's very easy to get the local knowledge that you need at the hospital you know what I have to reach spent three times as much time to the City Guards should I go to get the same information for square Wikipedia as people pull up the quickest way to about Q3 of 2021 at the earliest before we see meaningful recovery in that second I mean right now you know getting a bunch of people to travel long distances internationally to stay in tight quarters close together that's not exactly in both yes yeah I mean so what we're actually kind of looking at now for the future is at some of these hotels file for bankruptcy and go under you know probably in the coming 12 to 18 months those will represent attractive acquisition targets because the valuations will be much lower than they were a year ago for example so we'll see what the business is called Sky Squad and what that is is essentially an airport assistance service and so again it's an idea that was launched because of someone's practical needs so Julie Melnick who is the founder and CEO when she had kids that were young and she traveled with them through airports and on airplane she found out that was a pain in the neck and remember that one well myself and so essentially what we do is right now or Justin Washington DC but looking to expand Nationwide will meet the person curbside is the car pulls up help them with their bags their strollers car seats kids whatever get them checked in these are airport employees that work for us so they can go through security with The Travelers stay with them all the way until they board the aircraft and then bother at the gate or the lounge for whatever help them in any way whether that is watching the kids while someone goes to the restroom or running out to get food to bring back so it is just an airport assistance and it's very reasonably priced typically $99 for 2 hours and this has was launched in January of 2020 did well in January and February than the pandemic hit but even in the summer during the depths of the kind of covid-19 not what I expected to do everything ourselves as independent people which is fine I'm so you're the one sitting there was four suitcases two kids a stroller a car seat in two carry-ons how are you supposed to manage that if you just have two hands so I think this is a very valuable service and I think we're very well positioned to kind of ride the travel wave up recovery up that's a wonderful thing to have any important one thing that I would say that I found it took me a while to understand that it's how long juice work and it's relatively rare for people to walk up to a couple couple hours for $50 at an airport restaurant that sell expensive but you get a proper meal are they going to compete with this and obviously because people just maybe it's the volume of maybe it's just not a value proposition in the past has been kind of the exclusivity right which is like you know anybody can go to the restaurant but I get to go to the lamp but you know what I wants to get directions off location priority pass and competitors right I mean what are essentially aggregating these and selling them primarily through credit card partners with the exact amount just for me but it shouldn't be at the Old Airport was transformed into a big priority pass Lounge in airports really nice restaurants and get a priority pass meal credit of like you know $30 for five people that was one time Barcelona he came up this whole family of 10 people and you could go to so what that that wasn't saying it into an existing business where people only use on average that would drive down the cost and that's a good idea how many we're not there yet because we need to build some scale first as far as footprint around the us or around the world but once we have that scale then we talked to like a credit card partner and do something similar for that priority pass myself that that was not easy for travel to Japan it's it's just being an allowance cutting a couple for couple other people like helping is a miniature case that's anybody who has kids and traveled with them by airplane when they were young they always get this but anybody who doesn't have kids or have never traveled by airplane with kids they don't understand what the value proposition of this week things to be a consensus that they have no kids and yeah I mean my kids traveled in business in Even In First Class quite a bit back in the day and my wife told me a story once this has several years ago but I guess she was boarding a flight think it was like United and it was a domestic flight but they had you know international plane business class and they were getting situated and some guy was like apparently it's like throwing a fit she's like oh my God is this class is ridiculous ridiculous and he was apparently making a big stink about it and then finally she said to him he said something like he's like you know a you know we paid for these tickets so we have just as much right to be here as you but be she said it seems to me that you are making a much bigger deal out of this and being much more distracting to your our fellow passengers than my kids are and then that shut him up by the way only about half for 11:35 definitely something changing and travel category in the middle kids in business and even first class travel you don't for a sample in business class and they'll have their Nanny you know in economy or they'll be in first in The Nanny will be in business as well rain between Gulf Air as the original Middle Eastern Airline 80s the market if I had the hots for this strangely enough but I get the feeling that it's out of jealousy to Dubai Emirates Emirates was the first and then Qatar so you know Dubai split off and then create a Demorest and then guitar split off and feed a Qatar Airways then Abu Dhabi split off and created and the last was Oman with Oman Air what is cool cool with white why are they not so they were never part of that doll Federation and they have new planes but just cuz you have new playing it doesn't mean anything I did a lot of commonality say you go from Bahrain to Saudi Arabia it's almost like you but it's the same thing to take country Kuwait has I do kind of like you by weight is not as liberal as by rain I'm not as conservative as Saudi Arabia but yeah I mean I've never found Kuwait Airways iPhone Saudia quite a bit yes could be very shaky Define sodium call the thing involves so I I like to be involved in a few different business ideally 325 that means either as a investor a board member a consultant to part-time employee essentially having my hand in the pot because I have ADD not medically but I like to I get distracted easily so I would like to have a few different things to concentrate on what to do is it's actually a diversification no yes it's diversification within travel tourism and Hospitality but it's funny but those are my passions so if that's what I want to focus on so therefore it's good to be Diversified within the sector yeah I'm spending solidly probably 80% of my time on these three companies and and what it is essentially is a online booking engine like Expedia like Priceline and the difference is that is focused on helping Charities and nonprofit organizations raise money and the way that it does that He Is We marketed Charities and non-profits and then those Charities and non-profits encourage their employees and their employees families and friends their donors their Partners Etc to book travel whether that's business or leisure travel on this site charity protravel the pricing is exactly the same as you get on Priceline or Expedia but a small portion of that commission Revenue then flows back to back. So it's actually it's probable that people would have booked anyway and not paying any more for but they're just doing a little bit of good for a charity that you support do Amazon have something similar call Domino's on smile where people Charities and a lot of schools actually use Amazon smile and then a part of your purchase flows back to the organization's this is AmazonSmile accept specifically for travel I thought this would help rise when ovulating like rocket miles to miles I am not going to change the world and quickly I'm more of a progress not Perfection if you can revolutionize the world and change everything but progress is probably more so he wants to get your judgment call on what's going to happen with this whole traveltax what's happening with Google flights and hotel booking engine which is not yet but I'm looking at flights 365 days a year which was impossible to get before and it doesn't do such a good job with notifications I think five or six different destinations and receiver what month to get the best deal from my perspective that seems to be the end off many of The Meadows and also Expedia and hard line with a sources found from the owners the best price is actually on Expedia that's true okay that's just so he don't get to search traumatic definitely not the end of the money we just do you know and I I like Google a lot and I think that it's great as a consumer to use their services but it's not everything right the times when I personally have found a better deal elsewhere but I think I might have started with Google and then that gave me an idea but then I find an actual like got a hidden fair but a fair that is only promoted through certain channels else was very convenient by fast and it's kind of our daily bread and butter we do identify and send up links to Google Flights but most of the prices once you find dates for the best price you can Google Fiber prices of a fan up to twenty 30% or even individual travel agencies many of them and many of them in Germany for whatever reason that they seem to have also have a face lift in Germany at that company went bust but this tons of like a little travel agency Zoo today for mother of the kid now we don't like Google has been and maybe maybe with Google just like they do with search right part of the value is actually from the data so anywhere people steer after searching on Google flights that information is worth something to someone if they can stick until that off just to airport for Business Class fares to Bangkok for March and I don't book anything but now Google knows I'm interested in that or at least appear to be interested in that so then now they can remark at that information to Expedia or to Turkish Airlines or to Cathay Pacific who can then Market to me with good deal to Bangkok do you go to Eddie Heather amorettes that that was like you couldn't get rid of those ads for 2 weeks before I think we covered everything I've had that that was very awesome a cake for the last question American people reach you so if you search for me on LinkedIn